Speaker 1: GM.

This is Boone and you're
listening to Vaulted, a Web3

podcast series from the Schuller
Archives.

This episode was originally
recorded on September 17, 2021

and features Jimmy Eath, creator
of the Avastars project and

member of Flamingo Dow, and the
newly formed Xcopy Doom Dow.

In this episode, we dive deep
into digital identity, on-chain

reputation, the rise of student
enmity and much more.

As always, this podcast is for
entertainment purposes only and

should not be relied upon for
financial advice.

Boone and Guest man NFTs
discussed.

Now let's grab some coffee and
dive in this conversation with

Jimmy.

Good morning, jimmy.

How are you Great?

How are you doing man?

I'm doing well.

I'm doing well.

It's been a good week so far.

How about yourself?

Speaker 2: Good, I just got back
from New York City.

I managed to somehow sneak into
Jay-Z's 4040 club for his 18th

anniversary of that club and met
a bunch of really cool folks

and a couple celebrities.

And just back in Texas now.

Speaker 1: That's a pretty
strong flex for an intro man.

I like it.

It's pretty incredible.

It's one of the things I've
been talking a lot about.

This scene, especially in the
past couple of weeks, is that

historically, without this
technology that we're both

obviously obsessed about, is
that the barrier or the, I guess

, the level of access that we
get to have for being a part of

such a small community?

I think any barriers that were
there have completely

disappeared.

Speaker 2: Yeah, it's kind of
crazy the access that we're all

collectively getting to both
celebrity and entertainment and

brands and stuff right now.

And then also people tend to
think that I'm a big deal for

some reason and that they're
like, oh my god, you talked to

me and you took the time and
really I'm just like everybody

else in the space that just
loves what we're doing and if

it's either cool, it's the
future.

Let's talk about it and figure
out how to make it all work

together.

Speaker 1: And I think that's
part of the attitude that you

carry.

Specifically, what you just
said is people think I'm a big

deal, but really we're just all
in this together to talk about

it.

We love this new technology.

That's what I think is very
different.

I think what excites me about
this culture is because anything

new and shiny and exciting,
people tend to again put those

barriers in place and wall
themselves off.

But this community and this
culture has been entirely the

opposite.

Speaker 2: Yeah, I think part of
it is, too, that this stuff was

invented in 2017, a little bit
before perhaps, but 2017.

And then everybody left the
crypto space from our perception

, the NFT perceptions, the NFT
community, and we had 2018 and

19 by ourselves, and we still
felt like what we were doing was

very groundbreaking and
important.

And now that there's people now
that think the same thing and

are coming back, I think we're
also excited that what we bet on

is actually coming true, that
we're just willing to take the

time to spread the word, because
we were evangelizing all

through those times when no one
wanted to touch crypto.

So now it's fun, because every
time we tell somebody about it,

we can see them get excited.

I know it's a poorly timed word,
but it is what it is.

I call this the spreading the
NFT virus.

It's very much a virus, and I
can tell when people catch it

because they can't think about
anything else.

All of a sudden, you can see
the same behavior from one

person to another, so I don't
know what else to call it other

than a virus.

But my job, and all of our jobs
, is really to spread this virus

.

Speaker 1: There's some good
ones, man, yeah.

And just to give a quick two
minute intro or background to

who you are and what you're
doing, why you were just who you

are and what you're doing now
Sure.

Speaker 2: So I'm Jimmy, jimmye,
jimmy with a one.

I have been collecting NFTs
since 2017.

And I previously started
another business in the Google

enterprise space in 2007 and
exited that in 2013.

And NFTs is like what I was
looking for in between what I

left there and what I found.

And I started in the Crypto
Kiddy's community as a collector

and then I became a moderator
in their Discord and then

eventually got convictions to
build my own project and I built

Avestars, which is a personal
profile picture collectible

stored entirely on the
blockchain.

The images and the metadata.

That's important.

That won't go into why right
now, but they are.

They're there forever.

If you buy an Avestar, it's
always there.

And then now we're building a
minting platform called Nameless

.

Gary Vaynerchuk is one of the
first projects, his VFriends

project one of the first
projects to do that, and we've

worked with several other high
profile customers since then and

our building heads down
building right now so that we

can work with a lot more here in
the near future.

Speaker 1: That's incredible man
.

That's a great answer.

I think you practiced that one
before.

It's a little bit.

Maybe a little bit, yeah, yeah,
absolutely.

And just to give you a little
bit of my background, I couldn't

give two shits about the
blockchain in 2014, 2015, and

2016, and even really all the
way up until this past February,

and it wasn't hostile or it
wasn't personal, but it was just

that I couldn't find a real
life use case or I couldn't see

how this.

No one could really explain to
me how it was actually

beneficial besides like oh cool,
we just value this cool

technology, like awesome.

But now we're built.

Now, really, what got me into
the scene was when people sold

that 69 million piece.

That caught my attention.

I raised my eyebrows a little
bit and that's what I'll tell

you.

That's what caught my attention
.

But what kept me there was the
clubhouse room afterwards where

they had MetaCovin and Tubidor
in that clubhouse room and they

were explaining the reason why
they bought it.

They had one of the alien punks
I can't remember his name there

, but the alien punk with the
top hat and the pipe.

He was there and just hearing
the sheer like emotion and

energy that was being just like
shared in an office.

It felt silly to know.

Was it silly to?

Speaker 2: know, I believe so.

Yeah, did he sell that punk or
something?

Yeah, he went into like the
whole backstory of it, like the.

Speaker 1: You know the.

I mean why it was so important
to him, how it was a part of his

life, and I just said, this is
some.

This is incredibly nerdy.

But like this is this is so
cool man Like I, I feel like

this is exactly what I've been
missing.

Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think
that's like the beginning of

that virus that I was talking
about too.

You understood, like, just how
powerful this all was.

There's a great community there
.

I mean, the fact that you know
you can digital assets can now

be owned is the hard concept.

I mean, I think we finally got
past that right click and save

meme that everybody was talking
about.

You know, I've kind of looked at
the fool.

No matter who you are in the
world, if you say that, um, and

it's understood that ownership
means you can own it, yeah,

Someone else can make a copy of
it, but those people can't sell

it on the blockchain and you
know, like the person who can,

just like you know.

But people sold that 60 million
dollars, 69 million dollar, NFC

, right, and Metacovin paid for
it, Metapurse paid for it, right

, they were willing to put down
that money to do it and really

that moment was kind of like a
big spark for the middle stream

space, Um, and so really uh,
really important uh in the

history of NFTs.

I think you know even more so
as people look back in a few

years.

Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean,
and I think that's what.

Uh, what what I started
learning was when, when I

started diving into this, is
that I, you know, not only was I

a part of that clubhouse room,
I actually like recorded that on

my iPad, like on top of it,
like just because, like I wanted

to record that moment in
history, because I and I shared

that to my friend, I'm like
you've got to check this out.

I'm like you have to, like you
have to listen to the energy

that's in the.

You know the atmosphere and
it's just audio chat room.

We can't even see each other,
but we all just have this

collective spirit.

And I'll be honest, like even I
was sold, but I did about three

to four months of research
before I even bought my first

NFT because, like I was, I was
sold, but I'm still like that's

still a lot of money to throw
into this.

You know, on a, on a JPEG.

Speaker 2: Right, yeah, really,
the only reason I bought a

cryptic it initially is because
I was mining Ethereum and kind

of like you like there wasn't
anything to do with Ethereum and

I had a comeback.

Collectibles I love
collectibles and I love like

Video games and things like that
.

So to me, like I've played Dota
2 for, like you know, the last

eight or nine- years and, yeah,
spent thousands upon thousands

of dollars on skins in that game
.

Just that are just cosmetics and
some of them I can I sell and

stuff sometimes on the Steam
Marketplace.

But you know, I've always had
that desire to be able to

actually sell it for real money.

That doesn't involve like extra
steps and things like that.

And NFTs kind of to me like lit
that fire and I had a theory on

from mining theory of them.

So I had I didn't have to like
initially put cash into the game

, right like that.

I didn't end up buying you know
a couple hundred thousand

dollars worth of Ethereum for I
finally figured out how to just

like make money in the space
natively, but but Initially I

was just spending the mining
proceeds that I got.

Speaker 1: Gotcha.

I mean that's and that's cool
and I love that you brought

gaming up, because that's where
my roots are embedded, that's

where that's.

That's always been a place
where you know I could build a

community around something I
really loved, as though it was

my escape as a kid.

You know I'm a huge halo
First-person shooter.

I like here's the war, I like
call duty.

I like you know those are what.

Those are the games that I grew
up with and you know I think

the funniest use case.

Sorry, gotcha no no, but I think
that's the fascinating part,

because gaming, I think, is one
of the biggest use cases in.

In NFTs are like why they're so
valuable.

Because you look at the CS
history of like selling skins

for thousands and thousands of
dollars.

That provided that they didn't
do anything but it was purely

cosmetic skins are useful in
other games.

Speaker 2: Right, and that's
meta versus and that's what NFTs

unlock.

Speaker 1: Thank you, and I've
been trying to make that point

because I still have like a
couple toes in the gaming

community and the online twitch
streaming community and and

what's fascinating is that
they're still heavily on the

right-click save, as me like
there's still so heavy in that

and I just the irony is, Tell me
, like, use their like CS gun

inside of a fortnight game and
that's the pizza they're making.

Speaker 2: And to do that by
right-clicking and saving a copy

, a picture, that how are you
gonna do that?

If you can't prove you own the
gun there, the fortnight's not

gonna accept the picture of the
gun.

They're gonna accept accept the
proof of ownership layer, which

is a non fungible token, right,
right.

Speaker 1: And I like how we're
kind of like defining all these

simple examples through things
that we enjoyed, because I think

with me, the, the, the kickers
that Valorant is, you know,

probably has some of the coolest
skins on the market today, like

there's, like you can have a
dragon as your sniper rifle.

It's animated, it has these,
you know, blow smoke out, and

it's like.

Speaker 2: Imagine having
Valorant skins in other games or

imagine having like that in the
fascination yeah, this is

exactly where we're going with
things so like in like NFTs is

the bridge to get us there,
right?

So it mean gamers should I'm a
gamer like this is the dream

come true?

And hopefully, like other
gamers who are like

participating in these online
economies, in the games, like

understand that the next step is
this ownership that goes

outside of the platform that the
game is on.

And then, like developers,
understanding that means that,

like you know, that Valorant
weapon could be seen in

fortnight.

And how do you get that
Valorant weapon?

Well, you go and play this
Valorant game or you buy it off

of the a A marketplace, and
Valorant themselves can get a

royalty off of that sale.

Like it's a open, open
ecosystem that the metaverse

will end up, the the metaverse
will thrive as an open ecosystem

, yeah, and developers gonna
have no choice but to adopt open

methods, otherwise they're just
gonna be kind of forgotten,

right, waldo is they're gonna
die and I.

Speaker 1: I think that's an
incredible.

I love that statement because
it's, it's it's breaking down a

lot of the barriers that we like
, kind of going back to the

initial part of the conversation
, you know, but one a, since we

are a little bit crunched for
time.

You know, like I love touching
on the gaming thing.

It's, it's, it's something I'm
incredibly passionate about.

But you know, this is just one
use case of it.

Like, I like, obviously, this
is what I enjoy.

But to me, what I didn't know
about myself was that number one

in the traditional art world, I
could get two shits about the

Mona Lisa.

I don't care about.

Like, not to say that I don't
recognize the talent like, but I

don't see the value in that.

Like DaVinci, like, I respect
it, but I wouldn't be willing to

pay millions of dollars for it.

You know, now, like a Fidenza,
that is something that is a

pretty dope thing that if I had
the money to pay a million

dollars for, I would do it, you
know.

But it unlocked this new idea
of like, what art actually means

and what this generation
defines art.

You know, like what, how this
generation actually defines art,

because art is incredibly
subjective and it's what people.

Art is what people say.

Art is.

Speaker 2: Yeah, and I got it
all like two years ago for

basically calling someone's art
like trash and Like basically

saying this is bad art.

You know, I learned very
quickly that you know, baby,

like playing in their poo is
then wiping it on the wall as an

artist, like, if we can just go
to the like lowest primitive

that you can like anybody Just
say there are no artists, you're

not allowed to do with that.

Um, but yeah, no, it's really
interesting with the new like,

with the fact that, like NFTs
allowed digital artists and like

motion graphic artists and
things like that now, who just

had to be very career driven Of
this point in order to express

talent, to be able to come into
a space where people can

recognize that this is art I
appreciate and want to own.

Right, like before they may
have like been able to say, oh,

this is cool, like I can like
save a copy of this and maybe

set as my saver.

But there's a very different
primitive and Feeling about

owning a piece of art that
somebody drew that you know that

you own.

Um, and this is like.

This is like basically a
digital renaissance For art

taking place right now, largely
because of NFTs and the

technology that has allowed
people to create digital art

being Built up on these last.

You know this last like 100
years, nearly now.

Speaker 1: I guess, okay, man,
and and and traditionally art

collectors is a is a scene where
you just have to go on like but

I told, but but it, but I said
so.

Or like just trust me, dude,
you know.

Or like just you know, like
yeah, you know.

Speaker 2: I'm buying
traditional art, the world,

contemporary art, now real life
art, and you know, art dealer

tells me this is how much I just
sold this to this person for

and I believe it right.

Speaker 1: But, like you're
right, I think it's not like I

can look on the blockchain and
confirm some of these things

right and I and the reason I why
I touch on that is because I

think it we've you know, web 2.0
Introduced this culture like

web to know, like obviously
meaning social media, you know,

in e-commerce and digital
platforms and and interacting

with each other online.

I think it introduced this
really like we've gotten spoiled

with like being able to
literally just take, you know,

artwork and put it on our
computer, and we've also been

really spoiled in the sense that
, like we are, we are only

showing our best selves on web
2.0, like we're only showing the

, the dubbies, we're only
showing the victories and and

there's room up three week at
our wallet, or right now, our

wallet is our identity, right,
and there's a whole social layer

to that.

Speaker 2: Um, and people do see
everything that's done on these

wallets.

You know, granted, a person
could have, like you know, their

own other wallets they don't
disclose and things like that.

That's not actually how I
operate.

Like you know, my stuff's
pretty damn public.

Speaker 1: It's in your username
.

Speaker 2: Yeah, jimmy, I eat
one when, you know, at my vault,

which is also still tied to
that domain.

It's a vault that Jimmy dot e.

So you know, you know it's my
product, my stuff is known and

it.

It's really interesting because
you know, all that stuff is

there and and really like, I
think None of the tools have

really been developed yet really
do those deep and policies of

all this.

So it's gonna get really
interesting when people go back

and and find things in people's
wallets and, you know, figure

out how it all went down and the
connections between people,

like that social graph itself is
gonna be extremely interesting.

So I'm excited about it all.

I mean, look, I, I'm actually a
big advocate for, you know, data

privacy and user privacy.

I think zero knowledge proofs
we won't get into that.

That's a way to protect user
data and privacy in a way that

hasn't been possible up to this
point.

Also, it can be applied to NFTs
.

But I also believe that there's
something really powerful about

these online public profiles
and the way that the trans.

It's very Transactional and
transparent in nature.

It allows us to do things
without central authorities like

banks and things like that.

You could get a loan based on
your wallet and things like that

, without having to go through
traditional approval methods.

There's a lot of stuff you can
do here and you and, like you

said, it's not just gaming, it's
not just art.

These are like proof of
ownership.

I could be talking about the
deep home, with me talking about

keys to your car.

It can be your identity itself.

There's a lot of very important
use cases to be played out for

NFTs and I mean and, and even
take it a step further.

Speaker 1: One other issue we
have in touch on is music.

Like you know, every concert
ticket can be an NFT, like you

know.

Speaker 2: Oh, absolutely
concert ticket and people could

drop their albums in NFT.

I bought a music NFT this
morning.

My friend texted me about it
last night.

He said it's one of, you know,
one of the first.

He probably thinks it's the
first, but it's one of the first

musical NFT drops.

And so I went ahead and bought
one for point zero, eight, four

years off of like yeah, I mean
my first.

Speaker 1: I see my first NFT
purchase was the Kings of Leon

album.

Oh yeah.

Speaker 2: I want.

So, yeah, you got Kings of Leon
.

I was purchasing them from much
more obscure people on Super

Rare a few years ago as well,
like just examples, the first

examples of a music NFT.

So it's all there.

That's a huge use case.

Speaker 1: Yeah, right, yeah,
and it gets rid of these

secondary scalper markets Like
on, you know it it it does

create a secondary market, but
it can make it more reasonable

and it's not in the hands of a
central authority, it's in the

hands of the community.

Speaker 2: You know who's
getting the money, so then you

can start to figure some things
out.

Like you know, a lot of people
probably don't like Recognize,

like fully, that some of these
big ticket companies are like

providing tranches of tickets to
like resellers and those

resellers we're going using
marketplaces created by the

people who sold the tickets to
begin with created and just get

an additional feed.

You know, some of those things
are a little bit, you know,

bullshitty, yeah yeah.

So yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: I think it's a.

I think it's a massive one
because I'll tell you it's one

of the it's.

One of the things I hate the
most is that, like you know, I'm

a huge tool fan and you know
like it take it, sell out in

like seconds and they crash
websites and they in it's and it

.

But I will be I'm not super fan
that will pay a scalper to do

it.

Unfortunately, that's like one
of the few times I am, but we

get to.

We get to like, potentially
remove all that and if you buy

it From a person where you know
where the money's going, over a

company where you don't know
where it's going, you you know,

yeah, it doesn't solve all the
problems, but, like we said,

transparent.

Speaker 2: And then there can be
other ways, like there's.

There's the idea that, like,
you could set restrictions and

say, like you know, you have to
have an account for X amount of

time.

There's, there's lock chain
things you can do to like

basically set and gate things.

You maybe you have to have a
previous tool to get in your

wallet, right, you know?

Or you can't have ever had a
tool to get in your wallet.

If you want it all anyways,
there's like a bunch of like

cool stuff you could come up
with and, plus, you get to layer

.

At least we have a new system
that we can work with instead of

just being like behind like a
Curtain and not be able to tell,

like like.

That's why it's important to
talk and collaborate with people

and express ideas, so that we
can design new ways to do things

that are better and make more
sense.

Because, I guarantee you, these
ideas are all within Our heads

already.

We've already thought of them
through the years and our

frustrations, and playing these
video games and doing these

experiences.

It's the man.

I wish it was like this, or
imagine if it was like that.

Yeah, we all come together with
these ideas and talk about them

, then we're gonna be able to
build like a really great future

in the better.

Speaker 1: Yeah, and I love that
, and it's again.

It goes back to the culture of
like we and I think it goes back

to the root of everything
that's being built on, which is

the blockchain, is that it's a
trustless system.

Therefore, we have no incentive
to not be trustworthy to each

other.

Speaker 2: You know people,
people are, and that's gonna

happen, but there's I've sent
more money to people that I've

never met in my real life, like
you know, on a trust in a

trustless system.

But based on that, and like you
know, reputation matters as

well hey, and you don't want to
blow your reputation in a small

and nascent growing space.

It's gonna become less relevant
now.

People are now leveraging
people's reputations and saying,

hey, I'm this guy, send me
money please and I'll send it

back to you.

Like, oh, you're that guy, I'll
send you that money and it

turns out not to be that guy, so
Myself nor anybody of any

prominence will ever ask you for
any Eek or for asking for any

phrases or asking for any
passwords or anything.

We don't want it.

If somebody asked you for that,
just tell them to fuck off.

Right, right, exactly, yes.

Speaker 1: And I it's funny you
bring that up because, like it

wasn't in that specific scenario
, but just because this is brand

new and my lack of paying
attention I was doing eight

things at once.

I actually had a problem with
my hardware wallet and I was

looking it was with the collab
lamb bot or with one of the Bots

for discord to help me get a
new roll and it wasn't working

right.

So I'd contacted supportive or
telegram and Telegram and

mention in there in their
telegram is it will never reach,

it will never DM you.

First I said okay, so I I hit
the question, but then someone

DMs me and so I I Do.

The trust was there that this
was support.

They said, oh, it's just you
need to connect your wallets

together through this site.

Well, me, having complete blind
trust and not thinking twice, I

entered in my in my hot wallet.

My seed phrase All my teeth was
gone, yep, yeah.

Speaker 2: Yeah, I burn, yeah,
yeah, yeah, and it's been

happening more and more recently
because, like it's more popular

now and it's it really, really
sucks.

These are very expensive
lessons for people to learn.

Speaker 1: They are.

However, there's a.

There's a lot of things to be
taken from this number one.

It was point Four, five each
that got stolen, so it was not

by any means a small amount of
money, but it wasn't

life-changing money.

It wasn't like I bet the farm
on it and this is my life

savings, yeah.

Speaker 2: I've got my friends
who've gotten worked out and

like, not like you know,
hundreds of thousands, but like

everything they had in the space
, like on in a matter of moments

.

Speaker 1: Yes, right now the
good parts that, yes, you know I

got to keep my NFTs.

I had a reserve wallet where I
was able to transfer micro

transactions again to get the
gas, like to put it over, and

Just for those listening gases,
like the network fee used to

like move.

You know things on the
blockchain.

So the but the wild part and
I'll we'll be wrapping up here

shortly is that I'm actually a
part of the photo fractional

community and they did a
giveaway or they were doing a

game where they gave away two
NFTs To token holders and you

got to play a game.

What you needed to have more
money to play the game.

So I didn't, but I was airdrop
two NFTs.

Two community members actually
needed those pieces to complete

their collection to win the
master prize.

I got my entire investment back
in a week.

You know what I mean.

That's all I got to keep NFTs
and I got my initial investment.

I used my savings.

Speaker 2: You learn huge less
and I learned a huge lesson.

Yeah, okay at that.

Cost is not bad at all.

Speaker 1: No, it's not and, but
it just goes to show, I think I

experienced every emotion on
the human spectrum at day or

that that week, and that was
actually the day that I had

actually tagged you in that,
gary V2, and so I was

experiencing a rush from all the
engagement on that too.

That all happened within like
three days of each other.

Speaker 2: Four days, okay, oh
yeah, which is like a year in

the meta, exactly, exactly.

Speaker 1: Last piece I want to
touch on before we really wrap

things up, is Is around it.

Something that you mentioned is
that you've sent people

anonymous money in a trustless
system Based on the trust that

they'll give that back or
they'll give you what you had

asked for.

I think this, such as on a
larger picture, and again the

gaming community has a saying,
this, too, is the pseudonymous

culture, like a pseudonymous
society, like where, you know,

we don't see the actual people
that we're dealing with.

We deal with avatars, you know,
and to me, what I've seen is

that this, actually, like where
this has in some cases and a lot

of cases, can remove the
implication of human bias and

allow people to like work with
people that they don't know who

they are, where they're from,
they just know the

qualifications of what they can
do.

You.

Speaker 2: Absolutely.

And if you put a personal
profile picture in front of it

that's an alien or an eight or a
lion or whatever, then you have

no I and you don't know what
gender they are.

You have no idea who the real
person is behind it.

It drops those barriers very
quickly because you can't any

assumption.

No, like you can assume, this
guy looks like their personal

profile picture, this woman
looks like their personal

profile picture.

But you know, I was on, I got
into a I was in a Twitter spaces

yesterday and it was turned out
to be a podcast and the person

that got on had a picture of an
eight and I said, hey, man, and

it was one.

Yeah, yeah, right, she's okay,
it was a woman.

So you know, you can't even
assume gender or anything.

And, yes, I, it breaks down
barriers.

I've actually um, I'm wondering
if you'd heard me talk about

this anywhere else, because I've
talked About this other places

where I believe that this does
actually break down those same

barriers.

It allows us to Interact with
the person on the merits of the

conversation rather than judging
them for any other reason other

than like maybe what they're.

You know, if someone was using
like some personal profile

picture, thought was like a
crappy product.

I'm not judging them for that
Versus a punk, but they have

that punk.

You know, if I looked in their
wallet, they better own that

punk, because that's a whole
another thing, right?

So I actually think that, like
NFTs make good identity and that

an NFT can move from wallet to
wallet, so it's easy to identify

who a person is based on that
entity being in the wallet at

the time, and More so than a
wallet address.

But I totally agree that this
is a helps level the playing

field and gets rid of some of
the social issues that we see

today in society.

I personally am I'm doxxed, I'm
not, I'm Jimmy daddy, but you

can find out who I am if you
look into it.

Comfortable with that.

I've decided I was building a
reputation based on who I am.

But it's interesting in this
space that there are people who

have remained anonymous and
still found success as like

leaders and things like that.

Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I mean,
but you're, you're a perfect

example of building the future
while operating in the current,

present moment.

Like, what's the best way to
build this?

In the present moment, people
still need a face of the name

for a lot of, for a lot of trust
to be built.

You know.

Speaker 2: Yeah, the whole of
not an eminence, the anonymity

thing doesn't actually work.

If you want to be like a
Creator in the space like other

than some exceptions, like if
it's an artist like pack, that's

fine Like you really need to
know who that artist is probably

not.

If you have someone like you
know it worked for Satoshi

Nakamoto who created, you know,
bitcoin, but it wouldn't have

worked, I don't think, for for
Vitalik for creating Ethereum.

That next step, right.

I don't think there's very many
examples of it being a great

idea to be completely anonymous,
but I do that like having that

online persona that's behind
things.

It doesn't allow people to judge
you initially in a way that is

negative or has affected our
current culture.

I think that I think it is
important, yeah, and I do think

what you're saying is right.

Right now, we're in a place
where it has to be both to make

sense, but perhaps the future we
do move to that because we can

do reputation based on like
interactions and things like

that.

It hasn't been unlocked, yeah,
but the is there.

Once that's there and you have
someone whose reputation has

been built up over 15 years or
20 years, the chances of them

doing something nefarious with
that reputation are much lower

than someone who's had that
reputation for a matter of

minutes or months, and that's
when you can start to have a

little bit more suited to do and
I'm ended yeah, yeah, yeah.

And, like you know, I think
that's when it starts to make a

lot more sense.

Speaker 1: Absolutely, man.

Yeah, I mean I'm glad we ended
on that point.

I know we giving you about one
minute for your hard stop, but,

jimmy, I want to.

I want to thank you for coming
on, man.

I really appreciate you making
some time and hopefully we get

to do this again.

Speaker 2: Absolutely, man.

I'd be happy to go on and get a
couple months.

This is a great conversation,
absolutely, man.

Hey, have a going brother, all
right, take care.

Speaker 1: Thank you for
listening to the Schiller

vaulted podcast.

We hope you enjoyed the
conversation.

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